One of my BLOG readers has asked me to comment on the closing of St. Patricks Church. Usually I stay away from Religious conversations as it always seems to raise the hair on some Folks backs as all our views are different so here I go on my Soapbox as requested!
Just for the record, I myself, was raised Roman Catholic. My Father was a Ukrainian Orthodox, but my Mom was a Roman Catholic so that is how myself and all my Siblings were raised. I started Kindergarten in the old St. Joseph's School with Sister Immaculata and mid-year after our Christmas recess, returned to the new school built on Fourth St. We moved in 1956 and I was enrolled in St. Jude's in Wynantskill until shortly after the death of my Mother in 1961 and then re-enrolled in Wynantskill School by my Step-Mother. So I do have a religious education and can comment with this being stated.
I feel the closing of St. Patricks is doing an absolute disservice to the people of North Central and the surrounding areas, as many Parishioners who have relocated still attend Mass there. I had the opportunity to speak with Bishop Hubbard last year and I was very direct in telling him how wrong this was for the Community and how he was going to realize this after the fact, and should reconsider. I told him I was sure that he was not aware of plans for some redevelopment of his area, especially along the river and that the volume of the people living here was going to increase and for the better. These Folks are all going to be looking for a Church and probably the most beautiful church in the City of Troy is going to be shuttered. I don't think I fazed Bishop Hubbard, I felt I was looking into empty eyes. I wondered if he was even hearing me. Bishop Hubbard was raised here in this area, St. Patricks was his school and Parish and he is not fighting one bit for that Church or Parish, SHAME on him! All the support he received through the years from his Parishoners and this is what he gives in return! Shame on him TWICE!!!!! I don't think he should be let into Heaven, St. Peter at the Pearly Gates should look HIM in the empty eyes and say "you did not do what we put you on earth for, and especially as a PRIEST & BISHOP"! You did not fulfill your duties. sorry you are not getting in. The Gates of Heaven should then be closed on him as he is closing the Gates to St. Patricks!
You would think that of all Churches, he would want to save the one of the neighborhood he grew up in, but sadly it seems not to be the case. In fact, that is my rub with the Catholic Church and why I don't attend Mass any longer. I do not feel that they care about their Community, the physical Church is there, the Priests are there but to go to them about a problem in your Family or your Community, they are not there for you, they will refer you to someone else or an agency. THAT is not what a Church is all about, it is about keeping the flock attended, checking on Parishioners who have fallen on hard times, people who are physically sick or those who are misguided.
So to the reader who asked my opinion, there is it, you got me on my Soapbox. For those who know me, they know I speak from the heart and truthfully, and never lie, I speak it as I see it and KNOW it, and if you don't like it, maybe you are the person I am speaking of or are maybe dishonest yourself. So I can't see and I haven't heard of anyone who is in favor of this Church closing. All of the donations made for over 100 years to this beautiful Church are now for naught. What the walls of this Church has witnessed over the years, the Baptisms, the Weddings, Funerals, Confessions, First Communions, Confirmations, prayers and many many people living and long passed on will fade into a non-existence. I hope Bishop Hubbard reads this,I hope he feels terrible after he does. Am I being rough on him? No rougher than he is being on the Parishioners that have supported him for years! Keep it open and get us a new Bishop! Bishop Hubbard is retiring soon, so he doesn't' care, he will be safe and sound, but what of his Flock? Don't bother looking for him in Heaven, he won't be there.
Very well said. I was a devout Roman Catholic. Attended St. Patrick's School, made my First Communion there and was confirmed there. When I "grew up" I moved to St. Joseph's Parish in South Troy. Attended daily mass - adored the pastor, cherished every word he said and tried to live by his word UNTIL HE MOVED TO NEVADA WITH A MEMBER OF THE CHURCH CHOIR AND BECAME A MORMON! I miss my religion so much, but there's nothing there for me any more.
ReplyDeletewhat bishop hubbard does not realize is that these churches hold the neigborhoods they are in together. If you close a church down the neighborhood will go further down the tubes that it already has.
ReplyDeleteTina: Your remarks are well taken. I wish you would call St. Patrick's rectory 272-4666 ask for information on those who are trying to keep St. Patrick's open. Or even better why not attend mass Sunday morning, we could talk over breakfast.
ReplyDeleteI would like to say. All these people saying its a shame that the church is closing but where are they. I am not staying that the bishop had the right to close St.Pats because he doesnt. I think what we need to do is start to go to church and have people protest by not giving to the Bishop and writing him a letter.
ReplyDeleteThe Priest's and the people of St. Patrick's of Troy are always there for any one in need,and that goes for you to Tina. Give us a try.
ReplyDeleteTom said he agrees with what anonymous said about the Priest's and the people of St. Pat's being there for anyone in need. The doors of St. Patrick's are open for all. God Bless
ReplyDeleteCarol said...
ReplyDeleteWOW, Tina, you said it all; you hit the nail on the head! I totally agree! Very well said! But, the doors of St. Patrick's are open to all.
Thanks Tina for your thoughts. I agree with you. I can not understand how the bishop can close churches that are not in need of any help from him and give to others that are in need. St. Patricks church is not in need of any repairs and supports its self. The people need their churches.
ReplyDeleteThe bishop is afraid that people will think "oh look he changed his mind on his own Parish" when in fact he likes to brag that he had to close his own church, so people will feel sorry for Him. He has no backbone to face up to Father Patterson and the others who hate St. Patrick's. The need is there for the Catholics of Sts Peter's, Paul's and Patrick's to have one church opened of the three instead of having to crowd into Our Lady of Victory, or St Anthony's already overcrowded churches. Father Patterson can be happy he closed us all. Maybe we will all go to OLV and pay off his big mortgage. There is no mortgage at St. Patrick's and we are big enough to seat everyone including OLV.
ReplyDeleteSo why are they closing a church that is in good repair and has no debt to keep a church open that does have debts. Seems to me they have their priorities backwards. What happened to service, guess it’s all about the money now. KEEP ST. Patrick’s open
ReplyDeleteHello Everyone, I am happy to see that this post struck a nerve. I am hoping Bishop Hubbard read it. I know Folks from St. Patrick's did, and I am wondering also if anyone from the immediate Church has stood up to Bishop Hubbard in this matter. Don't be led like Lambs to the Slaughter! We don't want a Bishop that people feel sorry for like one Poster stated, WE WANT A LEADER! One who will fight for the Church to stay! Breakfast I can not do, very sorry, as I am cooking for the Guests at the B&B, then cleaning after breakfast and then up to the rooms. Please continue to post, communication keeps us all connected.
ReplyDeleteCarol commented the doors of St. Patricks are open to all, I believe the most beautiful, with St. Joseph's a very close 2nd, but how LONG will they be open to all? Not long.... Get those letters out to Bishop Hubbard and don't go easy, also get them out to the NEWSPAPERS!!!
thank God it is not up to tina urzan who gets into the gates of Heaven!
ReplyDeleteBishop Hubbard was that you?(anonymous previous posting) Are you listening or is that all you have to say. The people of NC, that includes Tina, know what is going to happen if this church closes. The whole fabric of this down trodden neighborhood will surely go to the devil. Its half way there. Close this beautiful church and you are turning your back on the LORDS' most needy. I believe that is why you became a messenger for Jesus, to help people in need, not take away what they need most.
ReplyDeleteSince this is a BLOG, and we are on the subject of who does and who doesn't get through the Gates of Heaven, who would you like to add that WOULD or WOULDN'T get admitted? OR would you like to run by me if "I" thought they would or wouldn't! One Blogger is very relieved that I am NOT in charge of the Gates of Heaven, (maybe that person is worried I would be up there sipping my Gingerale with my checkpad! Well BLOGGERS, let's have a go at it!
ReplyDeleteITS A SHAME THE WHITE KID WHO WAS JUMPED BY 4 BLACK KIDS IN LITTLE ITALY. WELL ITS NOT LITTLE ITALY ANY MORE I GREW UP IN LITTLE AND THEM KIDS WOULDNT EVEN WALK THROUGH WHEN THE MARKKET WAS AROUND THEY WOULD FEAR WALKING AROUND OUR STREETS SO PLEASE TAKE DOWN THOSE BANNERS AND PUT UP THE AFRICAN FLAG IT TURNS MY STOMACH WHEN I DRIVE THROUGH THERE!!
ReplyDeletediane dinon mcrae IT IS A SHAME THE CATHOLIC CHURCHES ARE GOING DOWN. I WENT TO ST. JOSEPH FROM 1959-1968. I'LL NEVER FORGET.MY DAUGHTER ATENDED ST. PATRICKS.
ReplyDeleteI would like to say as a memeber of St. Pats that is my family and my second home they have been there for me all the time. I do think though that the devil is tempting everyone. I do not think that GOD wants us to call names or fight on this matter I do know that we should pray and pray harder we are not going to go down for that.That is my Christian lesson.
ReplyDeleteAs for a person who is upset. I dont think our money should go to Randy patterson or Jim Spaniard from the Devil churches who is already spending our money that they dont even got. I think that We should just give our money to poor.
For the person who made comment about how the services at St.Pats there is nothing to do or anything thats bull there are so many people around that doing things and I am one of them. I also think that people say things on here but they dont believe it. When we had to close half the pews where was everyone not there the church still looked empty.
We the people at St. Pats worked our butts off but the anti christ so called REVS JIM, RANDY, ED, and So called deacon FRANK dont want st. Pats open and they lied to us and they cheated us and they treated the 3 Ps wrong. I am praying for all them and all the anti Christ who says its wrong but they dont go to church or anything. I am also Praying that Bishop Hubbard will change his mind because He loves God and He loves the church
Anonymous those of us among the St. Patrick's family feel your pain. There is no proof that anyone is spending St. Patrick's money that they do not yet have. Where this money ends up is totally up to those in charge at the Albany diocese. I word it this way because I feel that our Bishop has lost control at the diocese and financial layman will decide where these funds go.
ReplyDeleteOur Catholic priest are men of the Lord, to speak of them in the manner that you do does no good for anyone. With this said, they are men, and sometimes they fail our wishes and our expectations of them. I believe that this is what has happened to the Priest that you mentioned. We can only pray that God will lead them in the right direction, albet quickly.
I spent a lot of thought and time on "Called to be Church". Turned out it was a fraud. Had consistently given the church 50-100 dollars a month. Once all our hard work was thrown aside, they got ZERO dollars. Still do.
ReplyDeleteTo close St. Patrick’s Church, Troy, is wrong, very wrong. It is a sin, a mortal sin.
ReplyDeleteJust as Judas betrayed Christ, so, too, you, Bishop Hubbard, and your cohorts have
betrayed St. Patrick’s; and not only St. Patrick’s, but St. Peter’s and St. Paul’s. An
agnostic associate commented that “it would be a shame to close this beautiful church”.
‘Called To Be Church’ was a farce from the start. Its outcome was known from the
beginning. It did nothing but pit priest against priest, parish against parish and
parishioners against parishioners. The politics and hypocrisy of this diocese is
despicable. There certainly was a conflict of interest with the decision to close this
beautiful ‘House of God’, especially since Fr. Patterson (Pastor of Our Lady of Victory,
which is in debt) was on the cutting block board to close churches; and his church was
one of the ones in the cluster to be closed. It was disgusting how our people were
treated at that last meeting prior to the ‘Town Hall’ meeting. But woe to all of you
because you all will have to answer to a “Higher Power”, and God help you.
To drive good people from the church is disgusting and is another big sin. It just shows the politics, deceit, underhandedness and especially the greed of this diocese. You,who are in charge of this diocese, are no better than some of the Pharisees, Sadducees
and tax collectors in Christ’s day --- in fact, worse. It has become very clear that the devil is working full time here in this diocese. Satan is well and alive in Albany. Otherwise, this Church would remain open. It is FAITH IN GOD and PRAYER that are needed.
St. Patrick’s Church has a vibrant and active membership of 400-600 parishioners, and
has a history of bringing in converts. Since June of 2009 (less than a year), there were
68 confirmands, of which 15 were converts. St. Patrick’s is not in debt, and is in good
condition. The rectory, also, is in good condition, and could be used as a home for
retired priests. The priests who are able could say Mass. Remember, once a priest
always a priest (of course, unless defrocked) no matter what age.
So, why is this church being closed? Answer --- GREED and POLITICS; and, also, “the bishop does not have the backbone to stand up to Fr. Patterson” (whose church is in debt) and the others who have debts, hate St. Patrick’s and think that they deserve a piece of
St. Patrick’s pie.
Another thing, don’t ever mention ‘social justice’ because the only thing this
diocese is full of is ‘social injustice’. To close this Church is to slap people in need in the face. This Church takes care of many needs, not only the food pantry (Once A Week), but clothes the needy, helps to pay bills, helps to keep a roof over some people’s heads and heat and electricity for others. Also, “there are still people who walk here to church. There is no other church within walking distance. By closing this Church, you have taken away their place of worship.” But this diocese is so self-centered and selfish, it couldn’t care less about people in need.
You say the church is not a building, it’s the people. Well, if there’s no building,
there are no people. Stop spinning God and everything else. FAITH IN GOD and PRAYER are
what’s needed, not closing needed churches and driving people away from their religion.
These churches hold together the neighborhoods they are in. When you close a church,
the neighborhood is affected, especially middle to lower class neighborhoods.
The Priests and people of St. Patrick’s of Troy are always there for anyone in need.
The doors of St. Patrick’s are always open for all. All are welcome.
“All the people of St. Patrick’s Parish and those who have supported this Church
over the years are very hurt and angered by your actions”; and they have a good right to be. However, there is still time, Bishop, to step up to the plate and reconsider. Be stouthearted and KEEP ST. PATRICK’S CHURCH OPEN.
Part I
ReplyDeleteTo close St. Patrick’s Church, Troy, is wrong, very wrong. It is a sin, a mortal sin.
Just as Judas betrayed Christ, so, too, you, Bishop Hubbard, and your cohorts have
betrayed St. Patrick’s; and not only St. Patrick’s, but St. Peter’s and St. Paul’s. An
agnostic associate commented that “it would be a shame to close this beautiful church”.
‘Called To Be Church’ was a farce from the start. Its outcome was known from the
beginning. It did nothing but pit priest against priest, parish against parish and
parishioners against parishioners. The politics and hypocrisy of this diocese is
despicable. There certainly was a conflict of interest with the decision to close this
beautiful ‘House of God’, especially since Fr. Patterson (Pastor of Our Lady of Victory,
which is in debt) was on the cutting block board to close churches; and his church was
one of the ones in the cluster to be closed. It was disgusting how our people were
treated at that last meeting prior to the ‘Town Hall’ meeting. But woe to all of you
because you all will have to answer to a “Higher Power”, and God help you.
To drive good people from the church is disgusting and is another big sin. It just shows the politics, deceit, underhandedness and especially the greed of this diocese. You,who are in charge of this diocese, are no better than some of the Pharisees, Sadducees
and tax collectors in Christ’s day --- in fact, worse. It has become very clear that the devil is working full time here in this diocese. Satan is well and alive in Albany. Otherwise, this Church (the church that you, Bishop, said was the most beautiful church in the diocese)would remain open. It is FAITH IN GOD and PRAYER that are needed.
St. Patrick’s Church has a vibrant and active membership of 400-600 parishioners, and
has a history of bringing in converts. Since June of 2009 (less than a year), there were
68 confirmands, of which 15 were converts. St. Patrick’s is not in debt, and is in good
condition. The rectory, also, is in good condition, and could be used as a home for
retired priests. The priests who are able could say Mass. Remember, once a priest
always a priest (of course, unless defrocked) no matter what age.
Part II
ReplyDeleteSo, why is this church being closed? Answer --- GREED and POLITICS; and, also, “the bishop does not have the backbone to stand up to Fr. Patterson” (whose church is in debt) and the others who have debts, hate St. Patrick’s and think that they deserve a piece of
St. Patrick’s pie.
Another thing, don’t ever mention ‘social justice’ because the only thing this
diocese is full of is ‘social injustice’. To close this Church is to slap people in need in the face. This Church takes care of many needs, not only the food pantry (Once A Week), but clothes the needy, helps to pay bills, helps to keep a roof over some people’s heads and heat and electricity for others. Also, “there are still people who walk here to church. There is no other church within walking distance. By closing this Church, you have taken away their place of worship.” But this diocese is so self-centered and selfish, it couldn’t care less about people in need.
You say the church is not a building, it’s the people. Well, if there’s no building,
there are no people. Stop spinning God and everything else. FAITH IN GOD and PRAYER are
what’s needed, not closing needed churches and driving people away from their religion.
These churches hold together the neighborhoods they are in. When you close a church, the neighborhood is affected, especially middle to lower class neighborhoods.
The Priests and people of St. Patrick’s of Troy are always there for anyone in need.
The doors of St. Patrick’s are always open for all. All are welcome.
“All the people of St. Patrick’s Parish and those who have supported this Church over the years are very hurt and angered by your actions”; and they have a good right to be.
However, there is still time, Bishop, to step up to the plate and reconsider. Be stouthearted and KEEP ST. PATRICK’S CHURCH OPEN.
Fred & Dorothy Mall
Apparently, the "raping" of the beautiful St. Patrick's Church has begun.
ReplyDeleteYesterday, my husband drove by to see the doors to the church open wide, moving vans and workers, taking things out!!!
I guess Howard Hubbard (not a Bishop to me) needs money to fund his own personal church in Albany, or the building going on in Watervliet.
Karma will get Howard.
Here is an irish wish for Howard - "May the spirits of all the families, who donated hard earned money to St. Patrick's Church, haunt Howard, all the way to hell, where he belongs!"
I will visit Howard's grave one day, and I will personally remember him, in the way he deserves......